How Can I Be Best With Persephone?

Discussion in 'Q&A' started by ✫✫™, Nov 6, 2017.

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  1. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    In my own opinion, I still see Persephone used a lot and I consider her low A tier due to her ridiculously good ability to 1v1.

    My questions are the following:
    What is the best way to deal with multiple opponents when I have multiple teammates with me?
    If I needed to sacrifice Leech or attack speed, what would I worry less about having and why?
    Would the Tablet of Immortality increase my Leech effect?
    How important is Cooldown time reduction when her skills are so viable?
    Lastly, how would YOU build her from the start of a regular game and why?

    Any other tips that you want to give me to better my game are welcome!
     
  2. Riley12301

    Riley12301 Shmoo Staff Member

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    :sorb::ww::chain::rect::favor: +situational
    That’s how I build her anyway. Other prominent items include :arro: or :sss:.

    :hades: Or :dvs: for more defensive prowess.
     
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  3. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    I like this build, but why not substitute Searing Orb with Arrogance Cloak?
     
  4. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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    I'll post a video later and show you the build. Dont listen to riley he doesnt know shit
     
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  5. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    Cool, you can pm it to me.
     
  6. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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    https://imgur.com/a/AnGQW

    Haha hard to see the numbers. 5 points in movement, 1 in crit, 1 in leech. I personally use demolition on nearly every hero, it is the best, but noobs don't know that so they might disagree.
     
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  7. luciferrr214

    luciferrr214 Loli Slayer

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    I start off with :swisd: :haste: And three health spices. My core items would be :chain: :para: :lev: And :enchant:. My final build would look like :arro: :chain: :ww: :sorb: :sss: :rect:
    Situation items: :sqe: :zeal: :favor: :dvs:
    I prefer spider queen over Hades. Tabs that I use for Pers: [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2017
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  8. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    I love the Cooldown time reductions inscription idea. I see these tabs being better than piercing tablet since you have piercing inscriptions. I would use Dull Vine Shield and swap it with Searing Orb in most cases rather than rarely since most heroes suffer with low mana.
     
  9. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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  10. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    I have another question to ask: what heroes can destroy Persephone in a 1v1?
     
  11. luciferrr214

    luciferrr214 Loli Slayer

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    It depends on how good your laning skills are and how good your opponent is. But any other ADC like Leb Aria Frost can get the job done.
     
  12. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    Sure enough, I end up losing to an Aria once I read this.
     
  13. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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    start off with :swisd: :haste:And three health spices. then buy :lev:, then buy :sorb:. This goes for almost EVERY mage in the game. These items in this order is the meta for nearly every mage. After these items, your choice depends on your hero, and your enemies. For mages like kurzdor and melina, guervus, and other high damage burst mages, youre going to want to upgrade :lev: to :arro:, then buy :lev: again. so your items will be :swisd: :haste::arro: :sorb::lev:. Building in this order will ensure you have the highest damage output possible for the gold spent. buying armour is a waste of money until late game. Trust me, the best armour comes from you avoiding damage. Moving properly is the best defense, and its FREE. If you're good at positioning yourself, thats whats most important. Moving in between your hits is extremely important, but its something people rarely master until they are very experienced players. Its called stutter stepping/orb walking/kiting. And its probably among the most important disciplines a player can learn in moba. If your attack speed is 1.0 you attack 1 time per second, but in between your hits, you have 1 second of time in which you cannot attack. So what are you going to do with that time? Are you just going to stand where you are and wait for the next attack? NO. If you are chasing an enemy who you think you can kill, you need to be running in their direction IN BETWEEN your attacks to close distance. This will enable you to hit them more times before they escape than if you don't do it. It ensures you can stay within attack range so you don't waste time chasing them out of range while you're unable to hit them. Same with running away. If you need to retreat, but not to the point where you're going to die, you should be hitting the person chasing you as you're running away. This enables you to turn the tables on them by lowering their hp. If someones chasing you, dont just let them hit you and you're not hitting them back, UNLESS you're clearly going to die and you cant afford to lose any time attacking them. Learn hit and run, in all directions. Chasing, and retreating, learn to hit and run between attacks. #1 most important thing i've learned in my 5 years playing HOC, with 10,000 games played. I think I know what I'm talking about. I have more games played than anyone on this forum. A lot of times, people run away when they should be attacking, and its one of the biggest mistakes people make. They get scared, so they stop applying pressure.

    league of legends video explaining kiting. Take a look.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2017
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  14. Jacke0

    Jacke0 I love Akise

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    :dvs::rect::rect::arro::sorb::sss:

    Try this
     
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  15. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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    That's good but it doesnt help you for shit about the order. Noobs need to know what to buy FIRST and second and third, not final complete builds that if they build in the wrong order it will fuck them and they will get destroyed. Unfortuantely unless you are extremely experienced at hoc, you do not know the proper item order, which tablets are best in slot, combined with perfected talents. Anyone who says there isnt a perfect talent build for each hero is simply wrong. When I say perfect, I mean the build that has reached nash's equilibrium against itself. I'll try to explain it: Imagine 2 pro players, that were flawless, or as close to as flawless as possible. Think of it like if you could clone yourself and play against yourself at the same time. Or 2 identical super intelligent AI bots who played at a near perfect level. They are both using the same hero, and they play 100,000 games against eachother in a simulation. They will learn from every moment since they began about what is more effective and they will change their build accordingly, kind of like you have been doing since you started hoc. Eventually, after many thousands of games of tweaking their builds, they will arrive at what is called Nash's Equilibrium, which simply is the state at which you cannot benefit from changing your build any further. It means in the given circumstances, both players have achieved the optimal combination of trial and error which has resulted in the discovery of "the meta" as people vaguely refer to but most cannot explain thouroughly. The meta is the invisible but feelable and measurable limit of optimization in strategic gaming. Its the point at which your choices, (movements, items, talents, inscriptions, ect..) are built in the most effective way possible, providing the highest possible values available considering ALL of the other choices. This means testing dozens if not hundreds of combinations of builds for each hero. It requires either quantum artificial intelligence running simulations, like OpenAI did with dota 2, or a dedicated and intelligent human brain, which itself is a biological quantum computer.

    They made a quantum AI play dota against itself to learn the meta and play a perfect game, and nobody can beat it.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nash_equilibrium
    The Meta, or Nash's equilibrium, is a real thing. Its invisible, and exists only within the minds of the people who have done the work to find it. I didn't really find it until less than a year ago. Ive been playing hoc for between 4-8 hours daily for exactly 5 years now, sometimes more. Yeah, I'm addicted to hoc, I know. But there are people worse than me, trust me. I know 2 people that spend $3,000 each on hoc. I've spent around $200 in 5 years, not bad. The point is, I had played for 4 years before I really had mastered the game. I thought I was pro in year 2... Lol.. let me make something clear, just because you get rampages in custom 10k 15 rooms doesnt mean you're pro. Even through year 3-4 I thought I was really the shit, but I didn't really know the things I know now that make me realize I didnt know shit about the meta. I was just trying shit for 4 years, just testing everything. Believe me ive gone through pretty much every conceivable build for every hero.. Ive done it all, ive seen it all. I spent my time trying everything, ive spent a million emblems on my tablets alone. Shit is decked the fuck out. I have so much knowledge on every detail of hoc, feel free to ask any questions. Don't let any dumbasses try to tell you that you can play however you want and "everyone has their own best way to play". Thats some liberal bullshit and its dead wrong. Those are the type of people who build king killer 1st item because they like seeing crits because the color is red and they think its cool. There is right, and there is wrong. The sad truth is everyone starts wrong, and you have to build your way up, and to do it by yourself will take thousands of hours. It takes SO damn long to master this game.. With how expensive everything is, especially inscriptions, the exchange cost, and that annoying tablet unascend fee.. God knows I've wasted 200k emblems on that fucking fee alone... Ill share with you what I can. Just ask the right questions :)

    The best way to get better is to play 1v1s, preferably against yourself, but sadly we cant be in 2 places at once, so try to play against someone whos as good as you or better. This will force you to realize flaws in your build and make changes.


    They developed an extremely intelligent bot for dota simply by making the bot play against a copy of itself hundreds of thousands of times. Each game the bot would improve until it reached the meta, or nash's equilibrium, or as close to perfection as the game allows..
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2017
  16. Jacke0

    Jacke0 I love Akise

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    Chill.

    I didn’t wanna go into details.

    My HoC knowledge is reserved.
     
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  17. zalba idyllico

    zalba idyllico Active Member

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    An aside: Is ADC harpy a possibility? Not as a "meta", but something that can decently hold its own. Just something different.
     
  18. ✫✫™

    ✫✫™ AoV/HOC Username: greenjellyfish3

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    I would use that build for custom games, not in regular 1v1s.
     
  19. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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    No.
     
  20. ONYX

    ONYX Savage Daddy

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